Alliance Wars Early Access

[Nial]

Ok so we finally got our first war where we cleared the map. We had to beg players all day to finish one base, people ignored us, hid most likely because you had the three most active war mongers really wanting that map rest. When it reset only the inactive players could still attack. There is no incentive for us to clear the board. We thought we would get our gods back and go for round two, all of us on and excited…nothing. The active war participants cleared that map, we should be able to attack again. There is a huge disadvantage to having players in who are inactive on the map. We felt it yesterday. So perhaps in near future you guys could at least consider if a team has cleared the map all their gods get reset too, because chances are those are the only active war participants.

Yeah i wanted to deliver the same msg that a certain criteria being set, which if met... The Gods be reset... Not just clearing the entire map but maybe also on a player level because of there's an alliance with not a lot of active members it's definitely hard to clear the entire of the map in the first place with just the single deployment...

[Jay]

I really appreciate your efforts and support throughout the same but...
What we are trying to say is that... For the majority us i believe that it's not abt the effort that we put in for doing the few battles that the AW offers... Its abt the time we require to gain certain amount of resources... And it's simple that it has been reduced(on a per day note) than how it was when the war lasted one day... leroy suggested that it's abt the effort we put in... So it's simple that in order to make us satisfied with the rewards we want and you satisfied with the effort you want us to put... On a common ground you should just double the number of battles per god and increase the rewards per war by 100-150% whilst still keeping it a two day event
Thank you
Jay

Thanks for the thoughts... from your perspective, how do you find that War compares to other methods of earning resources in the game? We want it to feel like a great option, like something you will definitely want to do when you have the opportunity. But we also don't want it to be overwhelmingly better than everything else either. We want for regular battles to still feel like a valuable thing to do.

For example, we're able to make the rewards for Events / Weekly Challenges pretty special because they are only once per week and don't threaten to overwhelm everything else (such as regular battles.) We want people to feel great about the Events and want to do them, but we wouldn't want for them to be something that overwhelms the other aspects of the game. (Such as regular, multiplayer battles, which will always be important to us!)

So it's useful to hear how it feels like War compares for you to the other in-game activities as a resource-earner. (Thank you Diablo for breaking down how this adds up for your situation!)

[Jay]

Ok so we finally got our first war where we cleared the map. We had to beg players all day to finish one base, people ignored us, hid most likely because you had the three most active war mongers really wanting that map rest. When it reset only the inactive players could still attack. There is no incentive for us to clear the board. We thought we would get our gods back and go for round two, all of us on and excited…nothing. The active war participants cleared that map, we should be able to attack again. There is a huge disadvantage to having players in who are inactive on the map. We felt it yesterday. So perhaps in near future you guys could at least consider if a team has cleared the map all their gods get reset too, because chances are those are the only active war participants.

Hi Andreac, thanks for the feedback on this... there may be one aspect that I was not clear about when I originally described this City Reset!

When all cities are wiped out, these Cities come back for you to destroy again, but Pantheons are not rejuvenated. The idea for War is to see how much destruction an alliance can cause when they throw every god they can at the opposing cities.

The reason for the city reset is essentially as a tiebreaker. Imagine a situation where we didn't do the city reset and both sides wiped out the other side's cities. (Unusual but possible!) Then we would have a 1000 point to 1000 point tie. We wanted to make sure there are still attack targets for you, even if you wipe everyone out!

Basically, you keep attacking until you run out of attacks. So long as there are gods left, you can keep fighting.

I think, then, that your inactive players aren't really holding you back in this case, at least if I'm understanding your scenario correctly. I hope that makes sense, but of course let me know if I've misunderstood or left anything less clear than I should.

[Nial]

Thanks for the thoughts... from your perspective, how do you find that War compares to other methods of earning resources in the game? We want it to feel like a great option, like something you will definitely want to do when you have the opportunity. But we also don't want it to be overwhelmingly better than everything else either. We want for regular battles to still feel like a valuable thing to do.

For example, we're able to make the rewards for Events / Weekly Challenges pretty special because they are only once per week and don't threaten to overwhelm everything else (such as regular battles.) We want people to feel great about the Events and want to do them, but we wouldn't want for them to be something that overwhelms the other aspects of the game. (Such as regular, multiplayer battles, which will always be important to us!)

So it's useful to hear how it feels like War compares for you to the other in-game activities as a resource-earner. (Thank you Diablo for breaking down how this adds up for your situation!)

I certainly feel that The AW is a really awesome feature and i also highly support and appreciate your efforts and help...
but "some news on rewards in War! We have heard you on War rewards and SIGNIFICANTLY BOOSTED the amount of loot you receive in a War! Hopefully the new formula does a better job of hitting the reward sweet spot." These were your words when this new schedule and reward system was introduced... Right? As members we aren't saying that AW isn't beneficial at all or it's just worst... We all appreciate it and have been excited but after your words... It was genuinely expected that our earnings on a per day level will be greater... Simple right? But that wasnt achieved... There's no negativity or any foul feeling from my side at least...
That's all that there is...
And if you ask on a relative note... If AW is a great resource earner then yeah it's good...? But most of us feel it can be better... That doesn't mean that we are being 'Moronic' or unreasonable cause we feel it could've been better because we were told it'll be better right?
Thank you

[Spyder]

“Expectations” being the key word, expectations should be realistic. No thank yous for all the free resources banked during a long early test period, just negativity based on unrealistic expectations with no real attempt to reasonably look at the rewards system in place. Massive rewards for limited required play, and a feature that is highly competitive for anyone that values competitive play.

You do realize our issue, or at least my issue stems from their claim that they “significantly improved” the rewards we would be receiving? If they feel that we were getting too many, fine lower it, but then they try and make it out like they’re throwing us a bone saying they’re helping us out when, in fact, they are doing the opposite. For example, 365 days for the previous system we would get 4.7 billion, now with the new schedule in 365 days we’d get 3.4 billion. I just don’t like the sugar coating and what I’d consider lies / “bending the truth”.

[Diablo]

Thanks for the thoughts... from your perspective, how do you find that War compares to other methods of earning resources in the game? We want it to feel like a great option, like something you will definitely want to do when you have the opportunity. But we also don't want it to be overwhelmingly better than everything else either. We want for regular battles to still feel like a valuable thing to do.

For example, we're able to make the rewards for Events / Weekly Challenges pretty special because they are only once per week and don't threaten to overwhelm everything else (such as regular battles.) We want people to feel great about the Events and want to do them, but we wouldn't want for them to be something that overwhelms the other aspects of the game. (Such as regular, multiplayer battles, which will always be important to us!)

So it's useful to hear how it feels like War compares for you to the other in-game activities as a resource-earner. (Thank you Diablo for breaking down how this adds up for your situation!)

It’s the greatest resource earner in the game by far, but the fact that it is limited to a one time payout vs unlimited earnings like battles means the other features are totally still great options to play.

War is a must play feature that allows you to decide how much dedication to put towards it before you return to normal play

[Jay]

I certainly feel that The AW is a really awesome feature and i also highly support and appreciate your efforts and help...
but "some news on rewards in War! We have heard you on War rewards and SIGNIFICANTLY BOOSTED the amount of loot you receive in a War! Hopefully the new formula does a better job of hitting the reward sweet spot." These were your words when this new schedule and reward system was introduced... Right? As members we aren't saying that AW isn't beneficial at all or it's just worst... We all appreciate it and have been excited but after your words... It was genuinely expected that our earnings on a per day level will be greater... Simple right? But that wasnt achieved... There's no negativity or any foul feeling from my side at least...
That's all that there is...
And if you ask on a relative note... If AW is a great resource earner then yeah it's good...? But most of us feel it can be better... That doesn't mean that we are being 'Moronic' or unreasonable cause we feel it could've been better because we were told it'll be better right?
Thank you

I can more clearly lay it out like this:

• Rewards per war are higher
• Rewards per Gem from boosting are higher (since you are boosting much bigger rewards each time)
• Rewards per unit of passing calendar time are lower (since you are only doing 3 Wars per week rather than 7)

Hopefully that feels like a pretty accurate description; let me know if it still feels incomplete. I welcome the feedback on how this was originally worded, and I'll fix it so that it feels... sugar free?

I'm most interested in how this system feels now for folks, all other expectation aside. Our goals are for War to feel like a good earner, and something players will be excited to do when it's available (3x per week) but without being too out of balance with other ways of earning resources. And we definitely don't want people to feel burned out from it!

[leroy]

You do realize our issue, or at least my issue stems from their claim that they “significantly improved” the rewards we would be receiving? If they feel that we were getting too many, fine lower it, but then they try and make it out like they’re throwing us a bone saying they’re helping us out when, in fact, they are doing the opposite. For example, 365 days for the previous system we would get 4.7 billion, now with the new schedule in 365 days we’d get 3.4 billion. I just don’t like the sugar coating and what I’d consider lies / “bending the truth”.

[QUOTE=Spyder;n55932]

And I don't like the fact that you are calling these lies, when they are not. I don't like that you seem to think we have some sort of sinister evil intentions, when we do not.

For example, with the previous system you use all your gods once in 365 wars to get 4.7 billion, and with the new system you use all your gods once in 365 wars to get 7.05 billion.

This all came about because of two changes, that were frankly made completely independently of each other.

Change 1. Due to community feedback, we decided to make war 2 days long instead of 1 day, so that people wouldn't feel like they needed to be present every single day. This has nothing to do with war rewards. It is just a change the community seemed to want. (Note that I personally prefer 1 day wars, but I was in the minority)

Change 2. We wanted to make war basically the best rewarded feature in the game. When a player logs on, we wanted them to participate first in war battles, before, for example, doing something like daily challenges. So we increased the war reward by ~50%. This has nothing to do with war frequency, it was just a incentive/behavior change we wanted to introduce.

Now, somehow these 2 changes which, apparently unfortunately, were introduced at the same time, has convinced you that we are trying to lie to you and 'bend the truth' and slip something by you somehow. It is terribly irritating to me because it is just not true. They were just two independent decisions that happened to temporally coincide and you've decided to make a big deal out of it.

leroy

[leroy]

You do realize our issue, or at least my issue stems from their claim that they “significantly improved” the rewards we would be receiving? If they feel that we were getting too many, fine lower it, but then they try and make it out like they’re throwing us a bone saying they’re helping us out when, in fact, they are doing the opposite. For example, 365 days for the previous system we would get 4.7 billion, now with the new schedule in 365 days we’d get 3.4 billion. I just don’t like the sugar coating and what I’d consider lies / “bending the truth”.

And I don't like the fact that you are calling these lies, when they are not. I don't like that you seem to think we have some sort of sinister evil intentions, when we do not.

For example, with the previous system you use all your gods once in 365 wars to get 4.7 billion, and with the new system you use all your gods once in 365 wars to get 7.05 billion.

This all came about because of two changes, that were frankly made completely independently of each other.

Change 1. Due to community feedback, we decided to make war 2 days long instead of 1 day, so that people wouldn't feel like they needed to be present every single day. This has nothing to do with war rewards. It is just a change the community seemed to want. (Note that I personally prefer 1 day wars, but I was in the minority)

Change 2. We wanted to make war basically the best rewarded feature in the game. When a player logs on, we wanted them to participate first in war battles, before, for example, doing something like daily challenges. So we increased the war reward by ~50%. This has nothing to do with war frequency, it was just a incentive/behavior change we wanted to introduce.

Now, somehow these 2 changes which, apparently unfortunately, were introduced at the same time, has convinced you that we are trying to lie to you and 'bend the truth' and slip something by you somehow. It is terribly irritating to me because it is just not true. They were just two independent decisions that happened to temporally coincide and you've decided to make a big deal out of it.

leroy

[leroy]

You do realize our issue, or at least my issue stems from their claim that they “significantly improved” the rewards we would be receiving? If they feel that we were getting too many, fine lower it, but then they try and make it out like they’re throwing us a bone saying they’re helping us out when, in fact, they are doing the opposite. For example, 365 days for the previous system we would get 4.7 billion, now with the new schedule in 365 days we’d get 3.4 billion. I just don’t like the sugar coating and what I’d consider lies / “bending the truth”.

And I don't like the fact that you are calling these lies, when they are not. I don't like that you seem to think we have some sort of sinister evil intentions, when we do not.

For example, with the previous system you use all your gods once in 365 wars to get 4.7 billion, and with the new system you use all your gods once in 365 wars to get 7.05 billion.

This all came about because of two changes, that were frankly made completely independently of each other.

Change 1. Due to community feedback, we decided to make war 2 days long instead of 1 day, so that people wouldn't feel like they needed to be present every single day. This has nothing to do with war rewards. It is just a change the community seemed to want. (Note that I personally prefer 1 day wars, but I was in the minority)

Change 2. We wanted to make war basically the best rewarded feature in the game. When a player logs on, we wanted them to participate first in war battles, before, for example, doing something like daily challenges. So we increased the war reward by ~50%. This has nothing to do with war frequency, it was just a incentive/behavior change we wanted to introduce.

Now, somehow these 2 changes which, apparently unfortunately, were introduced at the same time, has convinced you that we are trying to lie to you and 'bend the truth' and slip something by you somehow. It is terribly irritating to me because it is just not true. They were just two independent decisions that happened to temporally coincide and you've decided to make a big deal out of it.

leroy

[Nial]

I can more clearly lay it out like this:

• Rewards per war are higher
• Rewards per Gem from boosting are higher (since you are boosting much bigger rewards each time)
• Rewards per unit of passing calendar time are lower (since you are only doing 3 Wars per week rather than 7)

Hopefully that feels like a pretty accurate description; let me know if it still feels incomplete. I welcome the feedback on how this was originally worded, and I'll fix it so that it feels... sugar free?

I'm most interested in how this system feels now for folks, all other expectation aside. Our goals are for War to feel like a good earner, and something players will be excited to do when it's available (3x per week) but without being too out of balance with other ways of earning resources. And we definitely don't want people to feel burned out from it!

Okay yep!!! Now it feels like the perfect thing to read
and also now since it has been laid out properly... From my end a two day war coming with 2 deployment of Gods is a really very better because 1) It's just more fun 2) It's also more resources for us... To compensate with the time... Since if that happens it'll in fact be 300% of the original so the majority is deemed to be happy in such cases and we are also playing almost double the matches and trying to finish as much as we can of the base also giving in more involvement within the war
Nice one Jay

[WORM]

To ensure everyone playing stays happy y dont u keep wars 2 days long however at the 24hr mark in each war return all pathenions to full or at least say like the players 5 most powerful gods ~ this would encourage active players to put more EFFORT in while still giving the less active players that only log in a couple times a week to still have a chance at playing the war

this would not require a greater raise in the rewards per battle or god usage but more so just meet everyone's needs and I am sure everyone above complaining who clearly are the most active players in their respective alliances will be able to get their greater amount of rewards

this would complete the loop and I believe satisfy everyone from devs to the GOO community ; )

[Olympia]

Hey everyone, thanks for the feedback on this so far!

The specific change was that rewards per War was increased by roughly 50%. The intent was to ease up on the overall pace of War but increase the reward folks are getting per War that they fight.

We want each War to feel like it's well worth doing, that compensation is good, but not have people feeling like they are getting tired of having to do so much of it.

If we've missed the mark on any of the above, we don't mind hearing so -- that's what Early Access is for!

Hi everyone,

Thanks Leroy and Jay for clarifying the reward system. I should have rephrased my message better yesterday. So here it is.

The alliance war is a fantastic feature and a good source of resources.. I always said it and I appreciate all your work. However, in this case as outlined by Nial in one of the posts above, we kind of expected something more as in total earnings per week. Furthermore, try to understand our point of view... during this testing time, we have become accustomed to a certain amount of resources per week. You cannot expect us to be happy with such a decrease in resources per week.

I still do appreciate the increase of resources per war as well. But at this stage, I believe there should be a system where players who want to contribute more in war are given that opportunity so they can receive more resources. Maybe second round of attacks.. or a certain amount of defenses. I don't know.. but something to let us earn more per war please.

[Andreac]

Thanks for the thoughts... from your perspective, how do you find that War compares to other methods of earning resources in the game? We want it to feel like a great option, like something you will definitely want to do when you have the opportunity. But we also don't want it to be overwhelmingly better than everything else either. We want for regular battles to still feel like a valuable thing to do.

For example, we're able to make the rewards for Events / Weekly Challenges pretty special because they are only once per week and don't threaten to overwhelm everything else (such as regular battles.) We want people to feel great about the Events and want to do them, but we wouldn't want for them to be something that overwhelms the other aspects of the game. (Such as regular, multiplayer battles, which will always be important to us!)

So it's useful to hear how it feels like War compares for you to the other in-game activities as a resource-earner. (Thank you Diablo for breaking down how this adds up for your situation!)

Thank you for response. We were at war with a much smaller alliance, and we have near 100, so aside from having a large chunk of players not attacking, the majority of the ones who do attack were able to clear the group. It wasn’t 100 vs 100, we would not be able to have the same results. I think because clearing a whole map is a rare occurrence, and I’m sure you guys can see the numbers of how many people are playing, maybe the draw of getting your gods back would entice more people to participate and finish a map. I can tell you that yesterday it was frustrating trying to get the group to participate, and it was equally frustrating and disappointing to many when something we were excited about doing had zero result for the people who did all the work.
anyhow, hope this is something you guys can consider.

[Spyder]

Hi everyone,

Thanks Leroy and Jay for clarifying the reward system. I should have rephrased my message better yesterday. So here it is.

The alliance war is a fantastic feature and a good source of resources.. I always said it and I appreciate all your work. However, in this case as outlined by Nial in one of the posts above, we kind of expected something more as in total earnings per week. Furthermore, try to understand our point of view... during this testing time, we have become accustomed to a certain amount of resources per week. You cannot expect us to be happy with such a decrease in resources per week.

I still do appreciate the increase of resources per war as well. But at this stage, I believe there should be a system where players who want to contribute more in war are given that opportunity so they can receive more resources. Maybe second round of attacks.. or a certain amount of defenses. I don't know.. but something to let us earn more per war please.

Unreasonable.