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Heroes no longer getting temples buff?

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  • #46
    Oh right so I see where the difference in understanding is coming from. I might be wrong 100% btw. But here's what I know, and the reason why I kept suggesting that last line. So everything is same, except the part where "after aphro temple goes down". In my understanding, normal troops keep any kind of boosts until they die (temple bonus + house bonus). Which is why I see troops from any kind of Aphrodite Environment (some with a lot of aphro houses and some without) remaining really really strong even after the Temple gets destroyed. So the troops remain super strong regardless of houses in Aphrodite Environment. Which lead me to have this conclusion. Troops keep Temple Bonus after it gets destroyed. But now I realized Hero is different, I was suggesting Hero to be the same. So yeah. That's it.

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    • #47
      Sorry, this may be somewhat circular, hopefully it's helpful to someone...just trying to understand too.

      I don't believe anyone keeps temple boosts after its cleared, just the house boosts - minus hades' house reanimate boosts. (Leroy kind of helped me feel more confident in that assertion a few posts ago, but we're all human)

      Not sure that map environment plays any role with regard to temple/house boosts, other than providing a wider margin of difference in strength/health for those troops spawned before and after the temple goes down in this aphrodite example.

      I understand the request as asking for the heroes to retain temple boosts for the entirety of the match when no other troops do. I don't understand the purpose of this. To me, this doesn't align with what I believe to be your overall intent in providing balance.

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      • #48
        No no, the only reason why I suggested hero to retain temple boosts is cuz I thought other troops act the same way. I'm not sure if that is the case, after what you said. If you're right in that troops don't retain temple boost after being destroyed, then yeah ofc hero should be no exception. It should act like all others. So if other troops retain temple boost after temple goes down, so should the hero. If not, then I was just misunderstanding the whole time.

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        • #49
          But I mean, if you're right, then this is completely different topic. Why troops/hero lose temple bonus while keep house bonus? Like, what's the difference between two bonuses? :P

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          • #50
            Originally posted by JKs View Post
            But I mean, if you're right, then this is completely different topic. Why troops/hero lose temple bonus while keep house bonus? Like, what's the difference between two bonuses? :P
            You are welcome to dislike the design, but it works the way it works weather someone agrees with it or not.

            Why would it work this way? Strategic balancing. Troops keeping or loosing all bonuses can make troops balance off. Splitting the difference gives both offensive and defensive strategies more weight. If the temple bonuses are high on the city it may be more strategic to focus on removing that bonus, if the house bonuses are very high it may be more strategic to focus on defeating the troops. This is very visible with Spartans guarding a target at a different part of the city. They can lose the temple bonus but still pack a considerable punch at the end of a battle because they were never defeated and hold their original house bonuses.

            Another way of looking at it is the troop is born with their house bonuses and have them till death, this bonus is a part of them, but a temple bonus is an added gift from the gods that falls after their temple is no longer on the map.

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            • #51
              Oh, I didn't mean it like that. Like I don't agree with it, so change it. I'm sorry you took my tone in that manner. I added that emoticon ":P" at the end for the purpose of saying "I'm just asking :P" xD

              But anyway, alright so I take it Rocko was right that even normal troops maintain only house bonus and not temple bonus after temple goes down. I'm really sorry and I apologize to everyone who took part in this post for not checking this fact first before posting a lot of messy points regarding hero bonus. I was 100% confident I was right, I don't know why but I just assumed that troops maintained temple bonus for the entire time I played this game, and I trusted I was fairly well informed player. Apparently not.

              But so back to the point, I guess that's needed then. To have balance between. I'm not sure if I agree with the last example you gave xD but you're absolutely right in keeping it this way if you guys think keeping both bonus is going to be too unbalanced between attack and defense. I personally think it's worth trying out, especially as how attack is slightly higher than defense right now, and also that I'm not very sure if this is going to be as huge as you described. Like I don't find that much of a difference between facing troops with aphrodite temple on or without, in the second push. So presumably, troops maintaining temple bonus wouldn't make much difference either. But ofc I might be wrong, and if you guys are sure about that, then the game should keep it.
              Last edited by JKs; May 6, 2021, 01:44 PM.

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              • #52
                No apologies needed, just friendly discussion
                Giving a permanent temple bonus would add the permanent heal back to heroes that was removed by making the Apollo troop heal only come from the temple, and not houses.
                This would also give a somewhat higher advantage to temples that are already very popular from their troop bonuses.

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                • #53
                  Originally posted by JKs View Post
                  But then why is Paris the most popular Hero still? :P If Achilles at Aphrodite Environment is too OP, then everyone is suppose to be using that. But instead, you can rarely see any other Heroes than Paris. So not giving Hero this Temple buff just cuz Hero is too OP in health isn't right. Cuz already now, players are choosing Hero's skill (Paris stun) over Hero's pure health and strength.

                  Besides, my point was based on the fact that it is very very inconsistent how the Hero lose Temple buff when destroyed while all the other troops are behaving in different way. If I'd have known this when it was first released, I would've definitely pointed this out. But I didn't know then, I automatically assumed Hero would not lose Temple's bonus, like other troops :P I don't understand why it was initially released this way to begin with, like the intention or idea behind it. But it's definitely inconsistent and kinda very unnecessary.
                  Well, the main problem is, that Achilles has huge health and protection, but health withers away from gods. If his ability got changed to short-term self-heal, then people would start choosing achilles instead. And, I personally prefer Achilles better. Also, I don't understand people choosing paris. Paris has very bad health. Against every base with paris, I've defeated paris before he even stuns a god (or maybe one or two, before they took away the area stun).
                  Last edited by Athene; May 6, 2021, 09:19 PM.

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                  • #54
                    Originally posted by Rocko View Post
                    Sorry, this may be somewhat circular, hopefully it's helpful to someone...just trying to understand too.

                    I don't believe anyone keeps temple boosts after its cleared, just the house boosts - minus hades' house reanimate boosts. (Leroy kind of helped me feel more confident in that assertion a few posts ago, but we're all human)

                    Not sure that map environment plays any role with regard to temple/house boosts, other than providing a wider margin of difference in strength/health for those troops spawned before and after the temple goes down in this aphrodite example.

                    I understand the request as asking for the heroes to retain temple boosts for the entirety of the match when no other troops do. I don't understand the purpose of this. To me, this doesn't align with what I believe to be your overall intent in providing balance.
                    I don't think heroes ever get reanimated. After all, it would be had to defeat a base with a supercharged superpowerful super fast achilles who is reanimating a bunch of times (200% reanimate makes it so that the reanimated thing gets reanimated, and 300% three times, 500% five times, and so on) running around the map and slaughtering the gods. After all, gods are more powerful than heroes (supposedly).

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                    • #55
                      Originally posted by Athene View Post

                      Well, the main problem is, that Achilles has huge health and protection, but health withers away from gods. If his ability got changed to short-term self-heal, then people would start choosing achilles instead. And, I personally prefer Achilles better. Also, I don't understand people choosing paris. Paris has very bad health. Against every base with paris, I've defeated paris before he even stuns a god (or maybe one or two, before they took away the area stun).
                      I personally preferred not using Paris, but for whatever reason, my defense rating always increased by 100 if I used Paris instead of other Heroes. That's why I was using him even if I don't really like his concept. But I guess I'll try using other Heroes later on cuz I now know they're not missing out on anything xD

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                      • #56
                        But treating hero like a normal troop by still keeping bonus from house after it’s gone just isn’t really fair since hero are much more powerful and it would make destroying a temple with many house boosting the hero academy first completely pointless. The gods didn’t receive much buff so that the attacker can counter those hero with insanely high amount of health and damage and sometimes range

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                        • #57
                          Originally posted by Seaweed View Post
                          But treating hero like a normal troop by still keeping bonus from house after it’s gone just isn’t really fair since hero are much more powerful and it would make destroying a temple with many house boosting the hero academy first completely pointless. The gods didn’t receive much buff so that the attacker can counter those hero with insanely high amount of health and damage and sometimes range
                          Hero is much more powerful but they are also much more expensive compared to other troops and they are like the one and only one type of unit on the field. So it's not unfair to give them the same bonus other troops receive.

                          Destroying a temple still takes away temple buff from the hero, which was what we talked about til now :P But if you still think taking out a temple with many house around hero academy is useless, then you can always try different tactic.

                          The gods didn't receive much buff, but even now after introduction of hero, attack is higher than defense. We should try to narrow down that gap, not widen it.

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                          • #58
                            Originally posted by JKs View Post
                            But then why is Paris the most popular Hero still? :P If Achilles at Aphrodite Environment is too OP, then everyone is suppose to be using that. But instead, you can rarely see any other Heroes than Paris. So not giving Hero this Temple buff just cuz Hero is too OP in health isn't right. Cuz already now, players are choosing Hero's skill (Paris stun) over Hero's pure health and strength.

                            Besides, my point was based on the fact that it is very very inconsistent how the Hero lose Temple buff when destroyed while all the other troops are behaving in different way. If I'd have known this when it was first released, I would've definitely pointed this out. But I didn't know then, I automatically assumed Hero would not lose Temple's bonus, like other troops :P I don't understand why it was initially released this way to begin with, like the intention or idea behind it. But it's definitely inconsistent and kinda very unnecessary.
                            Paris too can be really overwhelming if kept out of reach. Eventually, all the heroes are excellent if used correctly and efficiently.

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                            • #59
                              Originally posted by JKs View Post

                              Hero is much more powerful but they are also much more expensive compared to other troops and they are like the one and only one type of unit on the field. So it's not unfair to give them the same bonus other troops receive.

                              Destroying a temple still takes away temple buff from the hero, which was what we talked about til now :P But if you still think taking out a temple with many house around hero academy is useless, then you can always try different tactic.

                              The gods didn't receive much buff, but even now after introduction of hero, attack is higher than defense. We should try to narrow down that gap, not widen it.
                              The best way to narrow gap between attack and defense is nerfing Artemis and mono strategy or else those attack will just be far too hard for many players if the hero got buffed like that

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                              • #60
                                Buffing hero not gonna do too much to counter Artemis and mono strat so why not nerf it to give other patrons a chance to shine more?

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